Author Topic: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge  (Read 824 times)

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Offline priac

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Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« on: December 07, 2017, 10:49:05 AM »
Not that I expect they would ever change a longtime and successful format, but has anyone ever thought the Showcase Showdown shouldn't be strictly based on luck? 

After all, the whole premise of the show is to reward contestants who have knowledge about prices.  Sure some pricing games have huge luck components, but I can't think of one that is based strictly on luck like the SSD is.

My understanding is that when TPIR moved to an hour, most markets had them up against Wheel of Fortune which was gaining in popularity.  Therefore, the Wheel was born. I still think they could have thought of a way to incorporate pricing knowledge into the wheel. Create a 'prize wheel'.   Maybe have different prizes on the wheel instead of "cents", and whatever prize the contestant landed on, they would then have to bid on.  The closest bidder would win the prize and advance to the showcase.   For budget purposes, the prizes on the wheel wouldn't have to be ultra extravagant (except maybe on special shows).  Maybe 3 or low 4-digit prizes.  And you wouldn't have to have 20 different prizes every SSD.  You could have, say, four or five different prizes.  Each of the four or five prizes would be evenly spaced around the wheel. Contestants' bids would be sealed from one another in case they were competing for the same prize. Any price reveal(s) in SSD #1 would be replaced in SSD#2.    You could even have the occasional money spot revealed behind certain prizes as a bonus reveal should the contestant win their prize.  Or a cash bonus could be offered for a perfect bid. 

Sounds a bit time consuming maybe, so a slightly different wheel that spun faster would have to be devised.

This way, Price would still be using a wheel, AND including a pricing knowledge component to the SSD, without necessarily busting the budget.  The pure luck aspect of the SSD has always bothered me.



 

Offline JayC

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2017, 12:10:46 PM »
I never minded the luck aspect and the lack of pricing element in the Showcase Showdown. It allows redemption for those who didn't win their pricing game and someone that won a smaller prize in their game versus someone who won a car or cash. They could have just had it that the highest winner of each half makes the Showcase like the two highest winners made it when the show was a half hour but the wheel added an extra fun element inbetween halves.

What about The Price Was Right segment from the Doug Davidson nighttime version, would you prefer that over the Big Wheel?

Offline priac

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2017, 04:55:40 PM »
The Price WAS Right was a nightmare.  Along with the rest of that production. LOL

Offline Teddy

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2017, 08:51:56 AM »
As the saying goes, why would you mess with a good thing?

Offline GobGlom

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2017, 10:25:31 AM »
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Offline tpir7215

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2017, 12:22:34 PM »
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

I cannot overemphasize my agreement with that in this case.  The Big Wheel has been around almost since the beginning of the show's run (it first came up in like 1975 or something, only a few years after the premiere on September 4, 1972) and has become pretty much the ultimate symbolic element of Price (along with Plinko and Cliff Hangers of course).  Without it, the whole show (at least in my opinion) would be ruined not necessarily because of the absence of the Big Wheel per se (the show worked just fine without it prior to 1975), but because of its sudden DISAPPEARANCE after having been a successful and extremely popular element of the show for well over 40 years (and one that has showed up on literally every single regular Price show since Price introduced it besides The New Price Is Right from 1994)

Offline priac

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2017, 12:53:49 PM »
I'm not expecting it to be changed, nor do I think it should be given that it's a "longtime and successful format" as I mentioned in the very first sentence of my post. I,too, am against tweaking with success.

To be clearer, I believe the SSD should have ORIGINALLY been developed to include some sort of pricing skill element. I do not believe it should be changed now, after 42 years of success.  I guess I was imagining how a contest including a wheel COULD have been created to include at least some form of price knowledge.

It could have been just as successful and beloved as the current version.  Of course, many pricing games have major luck elements, but they always include at least some need for knowledge about prices. This is kind of why I don't like Plinko, and other games with too much "luck" element, and not enough skill element.     

After all, the show is called "The Price is Right".  The SSD is a mandatory hurdle in order for one to make it to the ultimate spot on the show - the showcase. Yet this key hurdle has absolutely nothing to do with pricing anything right.  (Granted, the 3rd spinner has a certain advantage)

On another topic, I think Rat Race is the most ridiculous game (or one of the most) on the show.  I'm sure it wasn't inexpensive to build either.


Online gamesurf

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2017, 01:13:37 PM »
As the saying goes, why would you mess with a good thing?
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

I certainly didn't see this thread as a suggestion that the Big Wheel should be done away with. Flawed or not, it's one of the show's icons.

The interesting question that I'm seeing here is: Is the Big Wheel iconic because it's been around for decades? Is it the best that the show could do? Or is there another interesting idea for the Showcase Showdown that we could have gotten if circumstances were different?

Pretend it's 1975. The show's about to expand to an hour but they need a way to whittle down six PG players into two. Pretend you're sitting at the production meeting where they're taking ideas. Nobody's thought of The Big Wheel yet; you're not replacing some already-existing icon. You're trying to come up with something where nothing existed previously.

Or pretend you're trying to introduce the format to a foreign country that hasn't ever seen Price. The country has strict regulations on TV game shows and doesn't allow games of pure chance, so they say you can't choose winners based on luck.

For example, here's a random brainstorm that I'm throwing out here:

Three players play old-school, Bill Cullen Price is Right on various prizes (could range from SPs to Easy as 1-2-3 level prizes). First to win two prizes goes to the showcase. Winner gets one spin of the Big Wheel for a cash bonus anywhere from $500 to $10,000.

Competitive, based on pricing knowledge, ties in with the premise of the show, keeps an element of luck and suspense. Probably would take a bit longer than the Big Wheel so it wouldn't fly in 2017, but in 1975? Maybe.

Offline Teddy

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2017, 02:15:31 PM »
(and one that has showed up on literally every single regular Price show since Price introduced it besides The New Price Is Right from 1994)
Ahem. Tom Kennedy's syndicated version of the mid 80s never had the Wheel; instead using the same format that had been used by the daytime show prior to 1975, and the Dennis James/Bob Barker hosted syndicated run of 1972-80 (where the top two winners automatically advanced to the Showcase round).

Offline JayC

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2017, 03:30:20 PM »
The Big Wheel is iconic because it's the most recognizable item on the show besides maybe Plinko. It's one of the things that people immediately think of in connection with the show. It's also provided some of the show's most exciting moments as well as some of the funniest. Yes, there's been a ton of moments on the show that didn't happen during the Showcase Showdown, but if there was never a Big Wheel as we know it today, there'd be several great moments in the history of the show that would've never happened.

Online tpirfan28

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2017, 04:47:15 PM »
The difficult part of this discussion is twofold: the iconic nature of the wheel after 40+ years and the fact they have attempted different variants on elimination pricing contests.  Obviously the New Price is Right's version has been mentioned and is known but the UK version had three different versions: the wheel, a game called Supermarket and another game entitled "showcase showdown".  Both are linked below.

UK Supermarket game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC1Xe27l7P0

UK "showcase showdown" game (towards the end of the episode if it doesn't start at it):
https://youtu.be/0rPsArBHPwM?t=2249
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Online gamesurf

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2017, 04:54:28 PM »
The Big Wheel is iconic because it's the most recognizable item on the show besides maybe Plinko.

That's the thing though... why is it recognizable? Is it simply because we've been exposed to it for so long that we take it for granted? Is there a difference between how you feel about the Big Wheel prop and how you feel about the actual Showcase Showdown round itself?

Yes, there's something viscerally exciting about a big spinning wheel. It looks cool. It looks like it would be a blast to spin.

But pretend it wasn't implemented the way that it was. What other mechanism could you use to pare six players down to two?

Nobody's saying they should get rid of the big wheel. The Big Wheel is not going anywhere. It's one of the icons of the show, nobody's disputing that. But that doesn't mean OP doesn't have some valid points. And it's a fun exercise to play "what if?" and see if humble fans can come up with any ideas that might compare to the ones the TPiR staff actually implemented.

Online gamesurf

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2017, 05:43:32 PM »
I wasn't aware of these, thanks for posting them!

Some random thoughts:

UK Supermarket game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC1Xe27l7P0

The set is Supermarket Sweep-esque, I really like that. Presentation is easy to grasp--it's multiplayer Grocery Game. It's the most "skill-based" of the two games.

But as a viewer, I'm not sure how I'd be able to play along. I think it may be too skill-based for the average US viewer; Supermarket Sweep works not because the viewer is trying to guess the prices, but because it's so darn fun to watch. The action here is pretty restrained and it only lasts for 15 seconds. It's not as visually satisfying as the Big Wheel.

UK "showcase showdown" game (towards the end of the episode if it doesn't start at it):
https://youtu.be/0rPsArBHPwM?t=2249

Interesting. Seeing all six PG winners sitting at podiums isn't as cool as the Supermarket game or the Big Wheel, but it's still sort of a visual recap of the whole show, and it's neat to see them get whittled down one-by-one in a sort of playoff. It seems like the most "fair" way to eliminate contestants that I've seen so far.

Downsides I can see? Waiting for all 6 people to reveal their guesses takes like 45 seconds, and it's kind of boring. Imagine Match Game if nobody made any jokes.

All in all: I suppose there's a tradeoff. You can get a game that's "skill-based", a game that's "fun to watch", and a game that's "easy to play along with", but the more you focus on one, the more tradeoffs you have to make from the other two.

Supermarket is very skill-based, but "easy to play along with" and "fun to watch" is kind of an afterthought.

The Big Wheel, on the other hand, says "screw skill and play-along factor" and goes all in on being visually satisfying.

The "eliminate the furthest away" game is the closest to the center. It's easy to play along with and it takes a decent amount of skill, and there's some visual entertainment there, although it's the least memorable of the three.

Offline Josh444

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2017, 06:52:09 PM »
In some alternate reality, I always imagined what it would be like if the show had a series of rotating elimination games vs. using the Big Wheel x2. The Big Wheel could certainly still exist as one of those games, but the variety would be interesting not knowing what was to come after PG#3 and PG#6. There were some cool games that existed on local lottery game shows (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqkJFg3zigk) that would have been pretty interesting if they were converted to multi-player games.

The predicament in using this method, though, is whether to use luck-based games or pricing-based games. If you use pricing-based games with large prizes (IUFB priced and up), does the winning contestant automatically win the prize? That would certainly affect the budget over time to guarantee two more prizes awarded per episode. Of course, so does $80,000 wins on the Big Wheel like earlier this season.

If you use luck-based games (like the Big Wheel) with different possible cash awarding variants, does it stray too far away from the point of the show? You could always give some kind advantage to the contestants who have won the most so far, to keep it somewhat-Price related.

Slightly off topic, but I always wondered what it would be like if the show only went with one "Mega Showcase" at the end of the show vs. two showcases. Have the contestants submit their bids in private, "Final Jeopardy" style. Same rules, award the Showcase to the closest bidder who doesn't go over. If there is a tie, the contestant who has won the most during the show is declared the winner (or there is some kind of tiebreaker).

Offline COINBOYNYC

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Re: Showcase Showdown Alternative to Include Pricing Knowledge
« Reply #14 on: Today at 01:20:05 AM »
has anyone ever thought the Showcase Showdown shouldn't be strictly based on luck?

There was always an element of luck in determining who got to compete in the Showcase.  Even when the show was just 30 minutes.

Before the wheel, the top two winners went on to the Showcase.  Obviously, contestants winning their way on stage have no say in what pricing games they're going to play or the top value of the prize they're playing for. So, if all three contestants won the maximum amount of prizes they could win in their assigned pricing games - if the 1st game was worth $2000, the 2nd $6000 and the 3rd $5000, the contestant who played the first game was eliminated through no fault of his own, even though he did everything right (that is, win all the prizes he had a chance to win), because he had the bad luck to play the pricing game that awarded the lowest dollar-value amount of prizes that day.
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