Poll

What should be considered a win for this playing?

Winning the car only
3 (6.4%)
Winning the cash only
1 (2.1%)
Winning either the car or cash with any amount of SP's correct
34 (72.3%)
Getting all 3 SP's correct, defaulting into winning either the car or cash
9 (19.1%)

Total Members Voted: 47

Author Topic: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off  (Read 1598 times)

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Online Flerbert419

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Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« on: February 17, 2020, 11:54:21 PM »
During today's episode, 1/2 Off was played for the normal $10,000 as well as a 2019 Mitsubishi Mirage ES hidden in a different box. In this way, it was possible for the contestant to only win one of the two big prizes.

Because it does not cleanly fit our generally accepted definition of a win (a car game is won if the car is won but a cash game is won if the big prize announced at the beginning of the game is won), I wanted to poll what should have counted for a win in this playing.

Some other notes:
  • The cash was shown first as a part of the normal reveal of the boxes and the car was introduced later.
  • As you might imagine, the cash was worth less than the car ($16,125).
  • Not counting bailouts, you could collect $19,999 from Time is Money, $9,000 from Pass The Buck, and $7,500 from Let 'Em Roll and all would not be considered wins.
  • In Super Ball!! and Walk of Fame when they offered a car it was possible to get the car and still not win the game.
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Offline RatRace10

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2020, 12:12:39 AM »
I say winning either prize under any condition. They're both in the same "tier" of prizes. Now, if it was $5000 cash instead, I'd probably consider that a non-win.

Offline gamesurf

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2020, 12:50:03 AM »
No definition of a "win" is going to perfectly fit all 77 pricing games. To the home audience and contestants, it makes absolutely no difference $20,000 in Plinko or $18,000 in Time is Money is just a "partial win" or even a "loss" in the official or semi-official record books. They don't feel like losses, the contestant wins something big and is happy, and that's the important part. It's presented as a victory.

But if we're absolutely forced to make one set of rules for all pricing games that determines whether it is a "win" or a "loss", I suppose we have to treat it as a cash game. I just pulled up Drew's explanation of the game, and this is how it was presented:

Drew: "Irene, it's your birthday. We have to have something nice behind that door. I bet this is exactly what you want for your birthday."
George: "You bet, you got a chance to win $10,000 in cash! Playing Half Off!"
Drew: "Yes, we have 16 boxes. One of those is stuffed with $10,000 cash. Your job is to pick the box stuffed with cash."

Boom. Right there, he says the object of the game is still to pick the one stuffed with cash. The "big prize" behind the door is the $10,000 cash. It's the first, big thing the contestant sees. Drew even uses the exact words "your job is to pick the box stuffed with cash". If she does not pick the box stuffed with cash, it's not a win.

Then Drew continues with the rule explanation:

 "...and you can eliminate half the boxes until you're down to two boxes, and I hope you do get down to two. Because it's Dream Car week, we have a little extra something to give away."
George: "We do. It's your brand new car!"

The car was presented as a bonus prize. According to Drew's explanation, the car seems like a consolation for "not" getting the cash. Despite the fact the contestant would clearly be thrilled to win either one, winning the car would be like winning the second prize in Any Number. Not a full loss, but not the big prize that you're supposed to be aiming for.

If we're hell-bent on making one set of rules apply to all 77 pricing games, and we're never making exceptions for special playings, then winning the car would be a partial win (or, if we absolutely have to measure it as either a win or loss, it would be a loss, like winning the #2 prize in Any Number)

But I don't think the contestant or the home audience would care that it was technically a "loss", and pretty much any contestant would be happy to "lose" the game in that fashion.
Quote from: Mark Goodson
"It's the greatest challenge in the world to invent a new game. For every one you see, every concept that is ultimately refined and developed, a dozen are worked on and not worked on, or almost worked on, or dropped because they don't read any more. We test and hammer and test and hammer...

When you finally get it down so that it looks very very simple, that one has had the most complicated amount of work."

Quote from: Bill Todman
"The sign of a good game, is when you don't have to explain it every day. The key is not simplicity, but apparent simplicity. Password looks like any idiot could have made it up, but we have 14 of our people working on that show. There is a great complexity behind the screen. It requires great work to keep it simple."

Offline TPIRfan#9821

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2020, 01:13:00 PM »
I always considered a textbook "win" if the highest-valued advertised prize is won. Since both the $10,000 and the car were advertised as separate prizes a contestant could win, under that definition, I would consider the car only being a win, while the cash being a partial win. I understand gamesurf's argument, but with that logic, the Punch for a Car playing should be considered a "partial win" because the contestant won the BMW over the $25,000, which I disagree with. And I will hold to that argument if they ever decide to do Punch for a Car again.

In reality, my definition of a "win" is arbitrary anyways, since I wouldn't be mad with either prize, and Dream Car Week is the week where we see wacky things on the show and just accept it. I'm still waiting for my Pay the Rent for a Ferrari.  :P
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Offline gamesurf

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2020, 02:21:33 PM »
Any one hard and fast rule that has to cover 77 games + funky special prizes in funky special weeks is going to eventually fall apart. This situation illustrates the absurdity of it.

I don't know what the show's official records look like, but apparently they demand that a game be marked as "won" or "lost" or "partially won" without any info any about what was won.

Maybe one of the production assistants would say "Screw the rule. The win/loss categories were made for the games, and not the games for the categories. I think it was a win and we just gave away a car so we're calling it a win". And they'd mark the game as "won", and nobody on this site would be any the wiser because they're under no obligation to publicly explain "well, actually, we use a different definition of 'win' under Dream Car Week and Big Money Week..."

In reality, my definition of a "win" is arbitrary anyways, since I wouldn't be mad with either prize, and Dream Car Week is the week where we see wacky things on the show and just accept it. I'm still waiting for my Pay the Rent for a Ferrari.  :P

Only if they have to trade away a Kia Rio on the $10,000 floor to play for it!  :oldlol:
Quote from: Mark Goodson
"It's the greatest challenge in the world to invent a new game. For every one you see, every concept that is ultimately refined and developed, a dozen are worked on and not worked on, or almost worked on, or dropped because they don't read any more. We test and hammer and test and hammer...

When you finally get it down so that it looks very very simple, that one has had the most complicated amount of work."

Quote from: Bill Todman
"The sign of a good game, is when you don't have to explain it every day. The key is not simplicity, but apparent simplicity. Password looks like any idiot could have made it up, but we have 14 of our people working on that show. There is a great complexity behind the screen. It requires great work to keep it simple."

Offline gamesurf

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2020, 02:35:37 PM »
but with that logic, the Punch for a Car playing should be considered a "partial win" because the contestant won the BMW over the $25,000, which I disagree with. And I will hold to that argument if they ever decide to do Punch for a Car again.

I actually just rewatched that because you brought it up, and I think you have a great counterpoint--she punched 4 holes. The BMW was in hole #3. When Drew revealed the BMW, the clangs and whoops went off and he told her to go run to her car. He never asked her if she wanted to look in hole #4 and they never revealed it.
Quote from: Mark Goodson
"It's the greatest challenge in the world to invent a new game. For every one you see, every concept that is ultimately refined and developed, a dozen are worked on and not worked on, or almost worked on, or dropped because they don't read any more. We test and hammer and test and hammer...

When you finally get it down so that it looks very very simple, that one has had the most complicated amount of work."

Quote from: Bill Todman
"The sign of a good game, is when you don't have to explain it every day. The key is not simplicity, but apparent simplicity. Password looks like any idiot could have made it up, but we have 14 of our people working on that show. There is a great complexity behind the screen. It requires great work to keep it simple."

Online pricefan18

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2020, 03:33:01 PM »
I actually just rewatched that because you brought it up, and I think you have a great counterpoint--she punched 4 holes. The BMW was in hole #3. When Drew revealed the BMW, the clangs and whoops went off and he told her to go run to her car. He never asked her if she wanted to look in hole #4 and they never revealed it.

This honestly would be the one big criticism I have of the Carey era. It feels like in situations like this, the games themselves are treated as an afterthought to the big prize(s). Ie: They don't really think about if whether they SHOULD do it, or more to the point whether it actually works within the structure of the game. They just do it.

Offline moneygamelover

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2020, 04:18:13 PM »
I voted for the game being won if either than $10000 or the car is won. I tend to have a loose definition of wins. It is and always been my view that any game is won if at least $10000 worth of cash or prizes is won.

I tend to look at it from this perspective: If I were a contestant, I would be very happy to walk out of that studio with over $10000 under any circumstances.
Adjustments that should be made to pricing games to make them fairer: Secret X: Add a 3rd SP so that perfect pricing ensures a win. 1/2 Off: Add a 4th set of SPs so that perfect pricing ensures a win. Master Key: Add 2 more SPs so that perfect pricing ensures a win. Rat Race: Add 2 more SPs so that perfect pricing ensures a win.

The following pricing games should be retired because there's no way or no easy way to make them fair: Spelling Bee, Plinko, Punch a Bunch, Pass the Buck, Let em Roll.

The following retired pricing games should be revived: $uper $aver, Give or Keep, Buy or Sell, Hurdles, Bump, Penny Ante, Credit Card, On the Spot, Split Decision, Add em Up, Walk of Fame, Barker's Markers.

Offline gamesurf

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2020, 05:43:12 PM »
This honestly would be the one big criticism I have of the Carey era. It feels like in situations like this, the games themselves are treated as an afterthought to the big prize(s). Ie: They don't really think about if whether they SHOULD do it, or more to the point whether it actually works within the structure of the game. They just do it.

See, if you're offering a car, I don't think it's a terrible idea to play the clangs and whoops at the reveal and celebrate a huge win like that. And you can't really take a moment to pause and say "you want to stop, right?" and then play the clangs and whoops, so you kind of have to end the game right there if that's how you want the reveal to go.

But for that to work, you need to make absolutely sure everybody knows the car is the big prize. You don't offer "the $25,000 OR the car".

I voted for the game being won if either than $10000 or the car is won. I tend to have a loose definition of wins. It is and always been my view that any game is won if at least $10000 worth of cash or prizes is won.

I tend to look at it from this perspective: If I were a contestant, I would be very happy to walk out of that studio with over $10000 under any circumstances.

Quote from: moneygamelover
Adjustments that should be made to pricing games to make them fairer: 1/2 Off: Add a 4th set of SPs so that perfect pricing ensures a win.

Signature checks out, I guess.
Quote from: Mark Goodson
"It's the greatest challenge in the world to invent a new game. For every one you see, every concept that is ultimately refined and developed, a dozen are worked on and not worked on, or almost worked on, or dropped because they don't read any more. We test and hammer and test and hammer...

When you finally get it down so that it looks very very simple, that one has had the most complicated amount of work."

Quote from: Bill Todman
"The sign of a good game, is when you don't have to explain it every day. The key is not simplicity, but apparent simplicity. Password looks like any idiot could have made it up, but we have 14 of our people working on that show. There is a great complexity behind the screen. It requires great work to keep it simple."

Offline imhomerjay

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2020, 07:47:22 PM »
Sometimes things dont fit into ludicrously arbitrary boxes. Get the car? You won. Get the money? You won. It really is that simple.

Online pricefan18

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2020, 08:55:25 PM »
See, if you're offering a car, I don't think it's a terrible idea to play the clangs and whoops at the reveal and celebrate a huge win like that. And you can't really take a moment to pause and say "you want to stop, right?" and then play the clangs and whoops, so you kind of have to end the game right there if that's how you want the reveal to go.

But for that to work, you need to make absolutely sure everybody knows the car is the big prize. You don't offer "the $25,000 OR the car".

I personally would rather it just be a dream car in addition to the $25,000 (or in 1/2 off's case $10,000). Make it a true bonus, vs. this way. But that's just me.

Offline Spmahn

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2020, 09:02:02 PM »
Honestly, given a choice between 10k in cash and a Mitsubishi Mirage Id take the cash, after paying taxes and fees and going through the rigamaroll involved in taking ownership, youd be breaking even with the cash and not have to deal with the sub-par vehicle.

Offline JayC

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2020, 10:51:03 PM »
My feeling during the playing was that since $10,000 is the game's regular prize and the car was more of a throw in just because of Dream Car Week, picking the $10,000 box still would've been a win. However, since the car was higher in value, picking it would've been a win also. I don't really think there's a wrong answer here.

Offline Teddy

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2020, 08:00:21 PM »
I must say, this playing threw me for a loop, but given the choice between the cash and the car, I'd take the cash, even if the car had a higher value.

But if the car was, say, a BMW or Lexus, then I'd choose the car instead.

Offline Grand_game2004

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Re: Winning the 2020 Dream Car Week Playing of 1/2 Off
« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2020, 09:17:32 PM »
Yeah, taking the car or the cash could be a tough choice depending on the vehicle offered.